iJohnHenry
Apr 27, 06:06 PM
I have a friend was name that way. Instead of putting JR in he puts II in.
Not kosher.
He is still Jr., no matter how much he protests.
http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_do_you_name_a_Jr_vs_II_vs_III
Not kosher.
He is still Jr., no matter how much he protests.
http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_do_you_name_a_Jr_vs_II_vs_III
xxBURT0Nxx
Apr 7, 11:11 AM
No indeed, it's not. Intel forced the whole OEM industry to use their IGP, not just Apple. ;)
No matter how you slice it, for some applications, IGPs make sense. Intel cut out the competence from that market with their shenanigans. And now the consumers pays for it with sub-par graphics processors.
haha clever, i'm not really arguing with you, i rather agree with what you are saying, i just don't put the blame on intel. Sure the whole debacle may have pursuaded apple to just use the IGP, but i think it's more of apples decision to make things as thin as possible that left out a dedicated gpu in favor of the IGP.
If apple really didn't want their customers to have to use intels graphics, they could have easily gotten around this, they just may have had to do some design changes they weren't willing to make. just my .02 but either way i wouldn't consider the 320m of old to be very high end either. If you are looking to game or need a high end graphics card you should stick to desktop, perhaps even PC over mac.
No matter how you slice it, for some applications, IGPs make sense. Intel cut out the competence from that market with their shenanigans. And now the consumers pays for it with sub-par graphics processors.
haha clever, i'm not really arguing with you, i rather agree with what you are saying, i just don't put the blame on intel. Sure the whole debacle may have pursuaded apple to just use the IGP, but i think it's more of apples decision to make things as thin as possible that left out a dedicated gpu in favor of the IGP.
If apple really didn't want their customers to have to use intels graphics, they could have easily gotten around this, they just may have had to do some design changes they weren't willing to make. just my .02 but either way i wouldn't consider the 320m of old to be very high end either. If you are looking to game or need a high end graphics card you should stick to desktop, perhaps even PC over mac.
marksman
Apr 14, 03:57 PM
Im waiting til June, if iphone 5 is delayed then i will jump to a nice android smartphone. Many people forget that cellular market has changed a lot and now competition is harder than before, there are nice alternatives, very nice ones.
But the iPhone 4 is still the best smartphone on the market and will continue to be so well past June.
If you want to choose to get an inferior phone because you want to chase after a spec sheet that is on you. That does not change reality.
A 4" display is already the standard size.
Just because Apple has not progressed is no indicator of their plans for the upcoming model. To continue to lag behind the rest of the pack with a little display would be sad.
LOL. Right.
But the iPhone 4 is still the best smartphone on the market and will continue to be so well past June.
If you want to choose to get an inferior phone because you want to chase after a spec sheet that is on you. That does not change reality.
A 4" display is already the standard size.
Just because Apple has not progressed is no indicator of their plans for the upcoming model. To continue to lag behind the rest of the pack with a little display would be sad.
LOL. Right.
dissdnt
Jun 9, 02:59 PM
Went down to Radio Shack today. They are doing a trade in but you're never gonna get the max price they offer unless it's out of the box new. My 3gs has normal wear over the year so they will only give 230 for it.
And I have a feeling trading in prices will drop when the iPhone 4 drops.
And I have a feeling trading in prices will drop when the iPhone 4 drops.
Erasmus
Aug 26, 07:36 PM
not trying to start a war or anything but...isn't that what the mac pro is for? isn't the iMac considered consumer grade while the mbp is considered professional grade??? i think it is badass that the mbp is faster than the imac.
Yes, but Conroe processors are less expensive than Merom for faster clocks, faster bus speeds, but increased power consumption, but considering iMacs used to house G5's, and they don't rely on battery power, Conroe is the logical choice for the iMac.
Obviously the MBP should get the 2.16 and 2.33 Ghz Meroms, as you couldn't put a Conroe in one, but the MBP should not limit the speed of the iMac, just because it's not "Pro", and I would personally consider the iMac at least "semiPro" because it is damn fast. I've said before that there is much too much of a price and capability gap between iMac and Mac Pro, which could easily be filled with a "Pizza Box" or more likely, and probably more favourable in my opinion, a "fullPro" larger version of iMac (upgradeable of course) which I designate iMac Ultra, cos it's a cool name.
There are good gradients between Mac Mini and iMac, MB and MBP, but not between iMac and MP.
An appropriately maxed (RAM and GPU) 20" iMac costs AU$3169.
A "comparable" MP (20" ACD, 2Ghz, 2Gb RAM) costs AU$5148
That's 60% more. Enough to buy a Macbook to take to Uni. Apple needs a ~AU$4000 option to fill the gap, ie. with a bigger screen, upgradeable, better GPU, better CPU, and I will be very happy. :rolleyes:
Yes, but Conroe processors are less expensive than Merom for faster clocks, faster bus speeds, but increased power consumption, but considering iMacs used to house G5's, and they don't rely on battery power, Conroe is the logical choice for the iMac.
Obviously the MBP should get the 2.16 and 2.33 Ghz Meroms, as you couldn't put a Conroe in one, but the MBP should not limit the speed of the iMac, just because it's not "Pro", and I would personally consider the iMac at least "semiPro" because it is damn fast. I've said before that there is much too much of a price and capability gap between iMac and Mac Pro, which could easily be filled with a "Pizza Box" or more likely, and probably more favourable in my opinion, a "fullPro" larger version of iMac (upgradeable of course) which I designate iMac Ultra, cos it's a cool name.
There are good gradients between Mac Mini and iMac, MB and MBP, but not between iMac and MP.
An appropriately maxed (RAM and GPU) 20" iMac costs AU$3169.
A "comparable" MP (20" ACD, 2Ghz, 2Gb RAM) costs AU$5148
That's 60% more. Enough to buy a Macbook to take to Uni. Apple needs a ~AU$4000 option to fill the gap, ie. with a bigger screen, upgradeable, better GPU, better CPU, and I will be very happy. :rolleyes:
*LTD*
Apr 6, 10:28 AM
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 4_3_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/533.17.9 (KHTML, like Gecko) Mobile/8G4)
This is impossible.
Apple isn't supposed to care about Macs anymore, just iToys.
This is impossible.
Apple isn't supposed to care about Macs anymore, just iToys.
samcraig
Apr 27, 09:26 AM
After an issue has arose and been debated to death and then even after the manufacturer has addressed the concerns of the paranoid, it is time to give it a rest.
But then when those who wish to beat what should now be a dead horse into little bitty pieces continue, then yes you are correct. Maybe whiner is not the correct title for these people. ;)
It's still news. The response came within the last 24 hours. If people are still debating this a few weeks from now - you can call them whiners... but it's current events in my opinion.
But then when those who wish to beat what should now be a dead horse into little bitty pieces continue, then yes you are correct. Maybe whiner is not the correct title for these people. ;)
It's still news. The response came within the last 24 hours. If people are still debating this a few weeks from now - you can call them whiners... but it's current events in my opinion.
stormj
Aug 11, 01:41 PM
Here are some of the issues with the iPod phone.
In order to make the biggest splash, it will have to be available in both GSM and CDMA versions so that all of the big 4 carriers can use it. GSM is the international standard, so I'm sure they will have that *at least*.
In order for it to matter, it will have to be able to access the music store over the air. Have you tried downloading an MP3 file, even on an EDGE connection? It sucks.
The delay here has more to do with the networks. Until the 3G networks are fully rolled out (EV-DO on Verizon, UTMS on GSM, etc. etc.) and available beyond a few cities, this phone will just frustrate people. (Verizon's rollout has gone much further, but I would think given that CDMA is rare outside of the US that that fails to compensate for the fact that the GSM 3G is still in just a few markets.)
The latest rumor is that wide-spread UTMS roll out will be in Q1 2007. When that happens, we'll see an iPod phone. It's not as if Apple couldn't have made an Apple-rific phone by now. The limitation isn't theirs, it's the networks'.
In the meantime, you can get an HTC Tytn that will use 3G world wide and will play MediaPlayer... if you're into M$.
In order to make the biggest splash, it will have to be available in both GSM and CDMA versions so that all of the big 4 carriers can use it. GSM is the international standard, so I'm sure they will have that *at least*.
In order for it to matter, it will have to be able to access the music store over the air. Have you tried downloading an MP3 file, even on an EDGE connection? It sucks.
The delay here has more to do with the networks. Until the 3G networks are fully rolled out (EV-DO on Verizon, UTMS on GSM, etc. etc.) and available beyond a few cities, this phone will just frustrate people. (Verizon's rollout has gone much further, but I would think given that CDMA is rare outside of the US that that fails to compensate for the fact that the GSM 3G is still in just a few markets.)
The latest rumor is that wide-spread UTMS roll out will be in Q1 2007. When that happens, we'll see an iPod phone. It's not as if Apple couldn't have made an Apple-rific phone by now. The limitation isn't theirs, it's the networks'.
In the meantime, you can get an HTC Tytn that will use 3G world wide and will play MediaPlayer... if you're into M$.
Mr. Retrofire
Mar 26, 09:22 PM
It's crap that is no longer needed.
It sounds like you speak about your own posts.
You are in a progress trap (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progress_trap), kid. It feels good that you are not responsible for the use of nuclear weapons. I'm sure you would use them, if you could kill "Rosetta" with them.
Stuff that can be cut out but isn't, holds back progress.
Your logic is flawed, because Rosetta is already "cut out" in SL. It is a separate option, if you know what that means. No? Now explain, how you cut something out, which is already cut out.
Progress = cutting and more cutting and then perfecting what's left over.
*lol*
It is important to note, that Apples success and progress in emerging markets in the past 10 years is associated with iTunes (it is necessary to access your iDevices), and the iTunes success is based on your biggest foe: The Carbon API. Or in other words: Apple would not be as big as it is, if Carbon and iTunes did not exist in the past. Strange that you must see now, that your enemies are your friends (and you use them daily).
It sounds like you speak about your own posts.
You are in a progress trap (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progress_trap), kid. It feels good that you are not responsible for the use of nuclear weapons. I'm sure you would use them, if you could kill "Rosetta" with them.
Stuff that can be cut out but isn't, holds back progress.
Your logic is flawed, because Rosetta is already "cut out" in SL. It is a separate option, if you know what that means. No? Now explain, how you cut something out, which is already cut out.
Progress = cutting and more cutting and then perfecting what's left over.
*lol*
It is important to note, that Apples success and progress in emerging markets in the past 10 years is associated with iTunes (it is necessary to access your iDevices), and the iTunes success is based on your biggest foe: The Carbon API. Or in other words: Apple would not be as big as it is, if Carbon and iTunes did not exist in the past. Strange that you must see now, that your enemies are your friends (and you use them daily).
designgeek
Apr 7, 01:55 AM
ULV CPUs (17W) will go to 11.6". The TDP of 320M is not known but 9400M has TDP of 12W so it is quite safe to assume that the TDP is similar to that. That means current 11.6" MBA has TDP of 22W (includes CPU, GPU, chipset) while SB 11.6" MBA would have a TDP of 21W (17W for the CPU and ~4W for the PCH).
13" will go with LV CPUs (25W). Again, currently it has 17W for the CPU and 12W for 320M. That's 29W. 25W CPU and ~4W for PCH gives you the same 29W.
11.6" - Core i5-2537M (option for Core i7-2657M)
13.3" - Core i7-2629M (option for Core i7-2649M)
Thank the gods for you sir, this is exactly what I was hoping to find in the comments. I'm also hoping they'll include Thunderbolt in the next revision. I'm totally going to get one in August if they do.
13" will go with LV CPUs (25W). Again, currently it has 17W for the CPU and 12W for 320M. That's 29W. 25W CPU and ~4W for PCH gives you the same 29W.
11.6" - Core i5-2537M (option for Core i7-2657M)
13.3" - Core i7-2629M (option for Core i7-2649M)
Thank the gods for you sir, this is exactly what I was hoping to find in the comments. I'm also hoping they'll include Thunderbolt in the next revision. I'm totally going to get one in August if they do.
treblah
Sep 19, 07:45 AM
The mermon G6s should be out before summer.
Fixed. :D
Fixed. :D
Vantage Point
Apr 27, 08:15 AM
So if I lose my iPhone and log into to my Mobile.me account I can see the iphones location and if it is moving. This is a nice feature to find your missing phone and track it - like leaving it in someones car, taxi or train. So I always knew this feature existed and considered it a feature.
Anyway, remember the gov't is looking for any hook to real in in Apple. They are a shining example of how a company should work - design products that people didn't even know they needed and sell them to a demanding public for nice profit without unions and turn a nice profit. Don't kid yourself on this.
Anyway, remember the gov't is looking for any hook to real in in Apple. They are a shining example of how a company should work - design products that people didn't even know they needed and sell them to a demanding public for nice profit without unions and turn a nice profit. Don't kid yourself on this.
shawnce
Jul 27, 04:29 PM
What would you suggest as an alternative to "successor" to describe these future chips?
The normally accepted definition of successor is one who replaces the one that came before it (as in succession).
The normally accepted definition of "next generation" in this field implies a new architecture (aka Core 2 to Core 3, or G4 to G5).
Kentfield and Clovertown are simply a different packaging of the Conroe and Woodcrest... putting multiple Conroe or Woodcrest chips into a multiple-chip module (MCM).
Not trying to quibble just make sure folks don't read things incorrectly.
The normally accepted definition of successor is one who replaces the one that came before it (as in succession).
The normally accepted definition of "next generation" in this field implies a new architecture (aka Core 2 to Core 3, or G4 to G5).
Kentfield and Clovertown are simply a different packaging of the Conroe and Woodcrest... putting multiple Conroe or Woodcrest chips into a multiple-chip module (MCM).
Not trying to quibble just make sure folks don't read things incorrectly.
Bakey
Apr 5, 06:09 PM
A very ignorant post. Especially if you value quality. I hardly call providing the best quality video "sucking money out of home consumers"
Or are you one of those that want to insist that streaming "hd" video is just as good as blu-ray. Because if you are - you shouldn't have even weighed in here.
No need to school you on the difference here though unless you come back and tell me you still think there's no difference.
+1... Maybe I should've snipped the quote, but I couldn't agree more! :)
Or are you one of those that want to insist that streaming "hd" video is just as good as blu-ray. Because if you are - you shouldn't have even weighed in here.
No need to school you on the difference here though unless you come back and tell me you still think there's no difference.
+1... Maybe I should've snipped the quote, but I couldn't agree more! :)
k2k koos
Nov 28, 07:30 PM
This would be like Ford paying Exxon a fee because some car drivers syphon gas....pretty weird!
Not quite, the car you syphon it from will still need to go back and refill... it's not duplicating the fuel....
The music industry needs a wake up call, there is probably no more complicated industry than this, with various copyright issues and loads of 'official bodies' legislating all kinds of stuff, and all because you thought of a song, recorded it with your 100 dollar acoustic guitar and want to sell it to make a living.. Try it, you can't. Once you have to go through all the above, your inspiration and will is flushed straight out....
Not quite, the car you syphon it from will still need to go back and refill... it's not duplicating the fuel....
The music industry needs a wake up call, there is probably no more complicated industry than this, with various copyright issues and loads of 'official bodies' legislating all kinds of stuff, and all because you thought of a song, recorded it with your 100 dollar acoustic guitar and want to sell it to make a living.. Try it, you can't. Once you have to go through all the above, your inspiration and will is flushed straight out....
Vegasman
Apr 27, 11:29 AM
Apple provides the option of encrypting your backups. I suggest that anyone concerned about the safety of their personal information use this feature.
Can you trust anyone to completely cover their bases correctly on this issue? Their "meh" data might be your "personal" data. The only way to be certain that the backups are encrypted is to encrypt the whole backup. Doesn't lengthen the time it takes much either, and you get to set the password to use/access the backup.
Yes, Apple made a bone-head move here. But there's a lot more personal information floating in the backups. SMS message history, 3rd party app data, etc. Not all of it is encrypted, and some of it you probably want encrypted.
In computer security class they will teach you to secure personal information by default. And if necessary to provide an option to unsecure it. I am sure Apple knows this. For some reason they chose not to follow this advice.
They are now fixing the problem. There is no need to defend them.
Can you trust anyone to completely cover their bases correctly on this issue? Their "meh" data might be your "personal" data. The only way to be certain that the backups are encrypted is to encrypt the whole backup. Doesn't lengthen the time it takes much either, and you get to set the password to use/access the backup.
Yes, Apple made a bone-head move here. But there's a lot more personal information floating in the backups. SMS message history, 3rd party app data, etc. Not all of it is encrypted, and some of it you probably want encrypted.
In computer security class they will teach you to secure personal information by default. And if necessary to provide an option to unsecure it. I am sure Apple knows this. For some reason they chose not to follow this advice.
They are now fixing the problem. There is no need to defend them.
TripHop
Jun 9, 12:25 AM
RadioShack store manager here and i have some very interesting information if you guys don't already know this.
Now, What do you think about getting your iPhone 4 at the shack? I'll see you there... :)I like the trade-in part. But must we activate the phone in the store? I would rather take the sealed box home and activate there over the phone with AT&T. Will that be allowed? :confused:
Now, What do you think about getting your iPhone 4 at the shack? I'll see you there... :)I like the trade-in part. But must we activate the phone in the store? I would rather take the sealed box home and activate there over the phone with AT&T. Will that be allowed? :confused:
RichP
Sep 13, 08:19 AM
Nice! Im with iGary and others, soon as they are out, Im buying. That should correspond nicely with the release of CS3.
Im doing work in Alias these days, I can only imagine how 8 cores could do a render!
Suprised the MacPro could handle the heat of 8 cores with its 4-core heatsink design. I read the article about Kentsfield on Tom's Hardware, and that chip made ALOT of heat; these are basically the same chip.
EDIT: Who knows, the hot setup may be a refurb'ed MacPro 2.0Ghz, then drop in better CPUs!
Im doing work in Alias these days, I can only imagine how 8 cores could do a render!
Suprised the MacPro could handle the heat of 8 cores with its 4-core heatsink design. I read the article about Kentsfield on Tom's Hardware, and that chip made ALOT of heat; these are basically the same chip.
EDIT: Who knows, the hot setup may be a refurb'ed MacPro 2.0Ghz, then drop in better CPUs!
SkyStudios
Apr 25, 04:36 PM
First things first, let Apple pay the fines becuase this is indeed a violation of our privacy, Google and facebook paid ober 300,000 dollars to Europe for it why should Apple not pay the fine?
Lets get to the real deal, Apple was already sued for violating privacy laws last year, they where not only storing location data but collecting users political views which required fallowing personal emails, chats, web history recorded regardless of you cleaning it afterwards with some paid apps.
Its a federal offense to not only tap someones line, stalk them with location recording but sell them a device, if people knew this they would never of purchased the device., let those poeple in Top companies who have FBI protecting them from Espionage SUE APPLE and Android companies too if they violate privacy laws becuase thats info you can topple a company with fast, especially competitors.
As for the naive kids who claim police can use this location data to find a rapists or perpetrator at large your dead wrong kids, here is a list of proceedings which have to be met to do this,
The cops can not at all even look into your phone, etc, unless your dumb enough to give them info, how ever a PI or detective can., cops and everyone else need warrants if they want to use this info legally, anything other then that is a personal decision and violation of someones rights, if cops had access to your phone who knows what issues we would have, they are not trained on legal matters, detectives, PIs, federal agents, Pis and detectives working under a lawyer who does, all going through the district attorneys office can, even journalists who are retired Feds, detectives, Pis or CIA agents can, they know the laws or their work is worthless in court.
Cops can however use police jammers, eves drop on your line through the district attorneys office via the phone company, they can even turn your phone into a video camera if it has one with out software or you knowing this, so can the feds, this all is also useless unless a warrant is issued, if cuaght they lose their license or get fined,
Maybe Apple will just pay the fine and walk away with money they made toppling other companies by spying on their employees. , but one thing is for sure, they HAVE TO CHANGE THIS GAME and also REMOVE KIDS APPS that prey on children to pay for more games with out them even knowing it.
Lets get to the real deal, Apple was already sued for violating privacy laws last year, they where not only storing location data but collecting users political views which required fallowing personal emails, chats, web history recorded regardless of you cleaning it afterwards with some paid apps.
Its a federal offense to not only tap someones line, stalk them with location recording but sell them a device, if people knew this they would never of purchased the device., let those poeple in Top companies who have FBI protecting them from Espionage SUE APPLE and Android companies too if they violate privacy laws becuase thats info you can topple a company with fast, especially competitors.
As for the naive kids who claim police can use this location data to find a rapists or perpetrator at large your dead wrong kids, here is a list of proceedings which have to be met to do this,
The cops can not at all even look into your phone, etc, unless your dumb enough to give them info, how ever a PI or detective can., cops and everyone else need warrants if they want to use this info legally, anything other then that is a personal decision and violation of someones rights, if cops had access to your phone who knows what issues we would have, they are not trained on legal matters, detectives, PIs, federal agents, Pis and detectives working under a lawyer who does, all going through the district attorneys office can, even journalists who are retired Feds, detectives, Pis or CIA agents can, they know the laws or their work is worthless in court.
Cops can however use police jammers, eves drop on your line through the district attorneys office via the phone company, they can even turn your phone into a video camera if it has one with out software or you knowing this, so can the feds, this all is also useless unless a warrant is issued, if cuaght they lose their license or get fined,
Maybe Apple will just pay the fine and walk away with money they made toppling other companies by spying on their employees. , but one thing is for sure, they HAVE TO CHANGE THIS GAME and also REMOVE KIDS APPS that prey on children to pay for more games with out them even knowing it.
Stellarola
Apr 14, 01:54 AM
My fianc� and I have been holding out since our first gen iPhones. This is a true bummer. I feels it's true. :(
KnightWRX
Apr 20, 11:35 AM
I pointed out the Grid layout many times in the other thread and was told that wasn't part of the lawsuit. If it is than Apple isn't just stretching... they are being idiotic.
According to the analysis, it is in the suit, as part of the trade dress claims.
According to the analysis, it is in the suit, as part of the trade dress claims.
fatfish
Aug 7, 09:35 PM
Actually - that's the exact scenario Apple talked about. HD goes down and with TIme Machine you can get all your stuff back. It backs up the system, files, apps - everything. That's almost verbatim from Apple's mouth.
I think the people who are complaining are likely using a notebook and don't permanently attach it to an external HD. I have to say I have little sympathy with this argument, if you run a notebook you need to have some back up system in place and should be prepared to regularly connect to either an external HD or a desktop.
Personally I have a little script that ensures that when I have a wireless connection to my home network an automatic incremental back up to an external HD connected to my network is performed in the background.
I did note some mention of a sync in respect of time machine, so hopefully X.5 will take care of occasional connections to an HD or desktop.
Time machine however seems to have 2 functions, restoring deleted files and full back ups. Even if you don't have access to a desktop or external HD, Time Machine will still perform retreval of lost and deleted files within a functioning notebook.
I think the people who are complaining are likely using a notebook and don't permanently attach it to an external HD. I have to say I have little sympathy with this argument, if you run a notebook you need to have some back up system in place and should be prepared to regularly connect to either an external HD or a desktop.
Personally I have a little script that ensures that when I have a wireless connection to my home network an automatic incremental back up to an external HD connected to my network is performed in the background.
I did note some mention of a sync in respect of time machine, so hopefully X.5 will take care of occasional connections to an HD or desktop.
Time machine however seems to have 2 functions, restoring deleted files and full back ups. Even if you don't have access to a desktop or external HD, Time Machine will still perform retreval of lost and deleted files within a functioning notebook.
pkson
Apr 19, 05:41 PM
After reading some of the lawsuit, I had to post this..
http://pk.funnyseoul.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/2010-11-04_174623.jpg
http://pk.funnyseoul.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/pn_20101104170853.jpg
http://pk.funnyseoul.com/2010/11/galaxy-tab-released/
http://pk.funnyseoul.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/2010-11-04_174623.jpg
http://pk.funnyseoul.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/pn_20101104170853.jpg
http://pk.funnyseoul.com/2010/11/galaxy-tab-released/
Cinch
Aug 11, 11:39 AM
This is probably the rumored Apple product I look forward to the most. Could really use a new phone, :p.
I agree at least since the iPod. As an investor, I hope Apple executes their plan well. The mobile phone business is getting crowded all of a sudden e.g. Best Buy, Disney, ESPN etc. I think it will come down to design e.g. Razr.
Cinch
I agree at least since the iPod. As an investor, I hope Apple executes their plan well. The mobile phone business is getting crowded all of a sudden e.g. Best Buy, Disney, ESPN etc. I think it will come down to design e.g. Razr.
Cinch
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